Cartoon African Tribesboy

t_hawkins · 09-03-2010, 01:42 AM

Ok, so this is my tribes boy, which is part of my final year project at uni.

I still have a lot to learn regarding character workflow, so any advice on how I should be doing things would be much appreciated.

I started with a load of tribe studies/sketches, from which I developed and explored in a more stylised cartoon way. From these studies I got this character turn drawn up (arms ended up being a little too long and head needed resizing..

Here is the model as it is now, I've added loops to try and make the mesh as even as possible for importing into mudbox so it's gonna need optimising eventually.
I've had a few issues along the way, mainly due to getting back into unwrapping/texturing. I used roadkill to get the unwrap started but like a noob exported my obj WITH TRIANGLES, which was good fun trying to remove AFTER I'd already brought back into max to work on for a further few hours. I ended up using quadrangulate, after getting some help on here.

Anyway It's at 7672 tris (without instances for the necklace) but I know I can shave off 500 quite easily.

without shorts:

with shorts in perspective:

For this character head I've loosely followed the animation book "stop staring" I'm not sure if anyone's a fan of the topology, but it's the best I've seen for animation so far.

Anywhoo, I've unwrapped, baked AO and done a basic first pass on the textures. They need more work but I want to move on to sculpting in mudbox now. It's been a while since I've sculpted but I have an introduction to mudbox dvd to help me out, also, I'm not going for anything massively detailed as it's a stylised cartoon character...

Here's texture with wires of the old messed up model:

I've read here that you get a better AO AFTER sculpting, is that right?

Will post up sculpt when its finished or if i end up having any issues...

Thanks for reading, any advice tips or critique would be much appreciated. =]

t_hawkins · 09-03-2010, 01:46 AM

oh yeah, what's the best way to go about making the eyes look wet?

Schmung · 09-03-2010, 03:43 AM

Specmap is probably your best bet for making the eyes look shiny/wet.

You will indeed get a far nicer result by baking the highpoly sculpt as an AO map and applying that to your model. In conjunction with your normals it'll give a better sense of depth etc.

t_hawkins · 09-03-2010, 06:59 AM

Cheers dude, I'll look into that.

I guess I can use a mixture of both; rendering one in Max by importing the high poly model, as well as adjusting the normals in Photoshop.. I'll have a play with opacity and layer styles and just go with what works best.. although, i have been getting pretty bad AO maps with this model, which have needed lots of touch ups in PS. Hopefully I'll get better results with the high poly model.

Just learning Mudbox at the moment, reading and watching tutorials.. Hope to have a half decent sculpt done today, as time is definitely running out for me! Still have an Elephant, Toucan, and Spirit Character to model by the end of April, as well as illustrations and a load of animation! =[

t_hawkins · 09-03-2010, 01:45 PM

Hello, just a quick question dudes/dudettes..

Is Xnormal the best way to go about baking Normal/AO from high poly to low? Been reading up and it doesn't look like you can just use render to texture on the high poly in max to get the AO. Or you can but you need a really quick computer! Is there any shortcuts to getting a decent AO?

Also, does anyone else just use Mudbox to get the Normal Map from or is that bad practice?

Thanks in advance..

stocko2k · 09-03-2010, 03:42 PM

i think more than a few people use mudbox/zbrush soley to generate normals and from what ive read and seen xnormal is pretty much as good as it gets for baking.

t_hawkins · 10-03-2010, 08:39 AM

Hmm.. Well time's of the essence so I might just use it for the ambient occlusion, and use Mudbox for the normal map.

Thanks for the quick response dude.

Has anyone heard of any good retopology tools for use in Mudbox??

Cheers.

Schmung · 10-03-2010, 09:37 AM

Xnormal is pretty easy to use, you just give it your highpoly & your lowpoly and then sort out the cage. Getting it to do normal, cavity maps, Ao maps and whatever else is just a matter of a tickbox.

t_hawkins · 10-03-2010, 05:52 PM

ok cool beans, gonna download it now. Looks like there's loads of different versions for some reason..

midwinterdreams · 10-03-2010, 07:02 PM

Yeah I don't suggest doing really complicated AO maps in Max. Pretty simple ones it can handle, but the really high poly is rough. I've been running 8 gig ram and still have issues with 5-15 mil objects for AO. Normal maps are a sinch, but render out that lighting and such is a max killer.

09-03-2010, 01:42 AM	#1 (permalink)
t_hawkins New Member 55 - 10	Cartoon African Tribesboy Ok, so this is my tribes boy, which is part of my final year project at uni. I still have a lot to learn regarding character workflow, so any advice on how I should be doing things would be much appreciated. I started with a load of tribe studies/sketches, from which I developed and explored in a more stylised cartoon way. From these studies I got this character turn drawn up (arms ended up being a little too long and head needed resizing.. Here is the model as it is now, I've added loops to try and make the mesh as even as possible for importing into mudbox so it's gonna need optimising eventually. I've had a few issues along the way, mainly due to getting back into unwrapping/texturing. I used roadkill to get the unwrap started but like a noob exported my obj WITH TRIANGLES, which was good fun trying to remove AFTER I'd already brought back into max to work on for a further few hours. I ended up using quadrangulate, after getting some help on here. Anyway It's at 7672 tris (without instances for the necklace) but I know I can shave off 500 quite easily. without shorts: with shorts in perspective: For this character head I've loosely followed the animation book "stop staring" I'm not sure if anyone's a fan of the topology, but it's the best I've seen for animation so far. Anywhoo, I've unwrapped, baked AO and done a basic first pass on the textures. They need more work but I want to move on to sculpting in mudbox now. It's been a while since I've sculpted but I have an introduction to mudbox dvd to help me out, also, I'm not going for anything massively detailed as it's a stylised cartoon character... Here's texture with wires of the old messed up model: I've read here that you get a better AO AFTER sculpting, is that right? Will post up sculpt when its finished or if i end up having any issues... Thanks for reading, any advice tips or critique would be much appreciated. =]

09-03-2010, 06:59 AM	#4 (permalink)
t_hawkins New Member 55 - 10	Cheers dude, I'll look into that. I guess I can use a mixture of both; rendering one in Max by importing the high poly model, as well as adjusting the normals in Photoshop.. I'll have a play with opacity and layer styles and just go with what works best.. although, i have been getting pretty bad AO maps with this model, which have needed lots of touch ups in PS. Hopefully I'll get better results with the high poly model. Just learning Mudbox at the moment, reading and watching tutorials.. Hope to have a half decent sculpt done today, as time is definitely running out for me! Still have an Elephant, Toucan, and Spirit Character to model by the end of April, as well as illustrations and a load of animation! =[ Last edited by t_hawkins; 09-03-2010 at 07:01 AM. Reason: .

09-03-2010, 03:42 PM	#6 (permalink)
stocko2k Game Art Student 295 - 76	i think more than a few people use mudbox/zbrush soley to generate normals and from what ive read and seen xnormal is pretty much as good as it gets for baking. __________________ its only good enough when i say its good enough and right now i'm eating a sandwich - MY TUTOR

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09-03-2010, 01:46 AM	#2 (permalink)
t_hawkins New Member 55 - 10	oh yeah, what's the best way to go about making the eyes look wet?

09-03-2010, 03:43 AM	#3 (permalink)
Schmung Senior Member 180 - 39	Specmap is probably your best bet for making the eyes look shiny/wet. You will indeed get a far nicer result by baking the highpoly sculpt as an AO map and applying that to your model. In conjunction with your normals it'll give a better sense of depth etc.

09-03-2010, 01:45 PM	#5 (permalink)
t_hawkins New Member 55 - 10	Hello, just a quick question dudes/dudettes.. Is Xnormal the best way to go about baking Normal/AO from high poly to low? Been reading up and it doesn't look like you can just use render to texture on the high poly in max to get the AO. Or you can but you need a really quick computer! Is there any shortcuts to getting a decent AO? Also, does anyone else just use Mudbox to get the Normal Map from or is that bad practice? Thanks in advance..

10-03-2010, 08:39 AM	#7 (permalink)
t_hawkins New Member 55 - 10	Hmm.. Well time's of the essence so I might just use it for the ambient occlusion, and use Mudbox for the normal map. Thanks for the quick response dude. Has anyone heard of any good retopology tools for use in Mudbox?? Cheers.

10-03-2010, 09:37 AM	#8 (permalink)
Schmung Senior Member 180 - 39	Xnormal is pretty easy to use, you just give it your highpoly & your lowpoly and then sort out the cage. Getting it to do normal, cavity maps, Ao maps and whatever else is just a matter of a tickbox.

10-03-2010, 05:52 PM	#9 (permalink)
t_hawkins New Member 55 - 10	ok cool beans, gonna download it now. Looks like there's loads of different versions for some reason..

10-03-2010, 07:02 PM	#10 (permalink)
midwinterdreams Senior Member 178 - 11	Yeah I don't suggest doing really complicated AO maps in Max. Pretty simple ones it can handle, but the really high poly is rough. I've been running 8 gig ram and still have issues with 5-15 mil objects for AO. Normal maps are a sinch, but render out that lighting and such is a max killer.